Dave yet again debunks Solar (Freaking) Roadways. This time the prototype SolaRoad solar cycleway path installed in Amsterdam in Netherlands.
Dave shows how to go about doing ballpark engineering feasibility calculations for such a project, calculates the expected payback period, and SPOILER, shows why Solar Roadways will never be a viable technology. This time using real measured data from the Netherlands cycleway prototype, and real measured solar insolation data for the Netherlands
Links:
1st Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=obS6TUVSZds
Live output data from Dave's 3Kw solar roof system http://pvoutput.org/list.jsp?userid=22501
http://www.solaroad.nl
Newsletter:
http://www.solaroad.nl/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/Artikel-SolaRoad-BU2013.pdf
Solaroads press release:
http://www.solaroad.nl/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/PressReleaseSolaRoadOpened_21Oct.pdf
Road Construction Costs:
http://www.worldbank.org/transport/roads/c&m_docs/kmcosts.pdf
Road network lengths:
http://ec.europa.eu/transport/themes/sustainable/studies/doc/2008_road_infrastructure_costs_and_revenues.pdf
Average Household Energy Consumption:
http://www.eci.ox.ac.uk/research/energy/downloads/countrypictures/cp_netherlands.pdf
Price Per Watt for solar panels:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_per_watt
PV System installation costs:
http://www.nrel.gov/docs/fy13osti/56776.pdf
Solar Irradiance / Insolation data:
http://solarelectricityhandbook.com/solar-irradiance.html
Electricity prices for households:
http://epp.eurostat.ec.europa.eu/statistics_explained/index.php/File:Electricity_prices_for_household_consumers,_first_half_2013_%281%29_%28EUR_per_kWh%29_YB14.png
Sunpower P18 solar panel:
http://hvce.com/admin/content/uploads/Sunpower230.pdf
Forum: http://www.eevblog.com/forum/blog/eevblog-681-more-solar-roadways-bullshit!/'>http://www.eevblog.com/forum/blog/eevblog-681-more-solar-roadways-bullshit!/
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Dave shows how to go about doing ballpark engineering feasibility calculations for such a project, calculates the expected payback period, and SPOILER, shows why Solar Roadways will never be a viable technology. This time using real measured data from the Netherlands cycleway prototype, and real measured solar insolation data for the Netherlands
Links:
1st Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=obS6TUVSZds
Live output data from Dave's 3Kw solar roof system http://pvoutput.org/list.jsp?userid=22501
http://www.solaroad.nl
Newsletter:
http://www.solaroad.nl/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/Artikel-SolaRoad-BU2013.pdf
Solaroads press release:
http://www.solaroad.nl/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/PressReleaseSolaRoadOpened_21Oct.pdf
Road Construction Costs:
http://www.worldbank.org/transport/roads/c&m_docs/kmcosts.pdf
Road network lengths:
http://ec.europa.eu/transport/themes/sustainable/studies/doc/2008_road_infrastructure_costs_and_revenues.pdf
Average Household Energy Consumption:
http://www.eci.ox.ac.uk/research/energy/downloads/countrypictures/cp_netherlands.pdf
Price Per Watt for solar panels:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_per_watt
PV System installation costs:
http://www.nrel.gov/docs/fy13osti/56776.pdf
Solar Irradiance / Insolation data:
http://solarelectricityhandbook.com/solar-irradiance.html
Electricity prices for households:
http://epp.eurostat.ec.europa.eu/statistics_explained/index.php/File:Electricity_prices_for_household_consumers,_first_half_2013_%281%29_%28EUR_per_kWh%29_YB14.png
Sunpower P18 solar panel:
http://hvce.com/admin/content/uploads/Sunpower230.pdf
Forum: http://www.eevblog.com/forum/blog/eevblog-681-more-solar-roadways-bullshit!/'>http://www.eevblog.com/forum/blog/eevblog-681-more-solar-roadways-bullshit!/
EEVblog Main Web Site: http://www.eevblog.com
The 2nd EEVblog Channel: http://www.youtube.com/EEVblog2
Support the EEVblog through Patreon!
http://www.patreon.com/eevblog
EEVblog Amazon Store (Dave gets a cut):
http://astore.amazon.com/eevblogstore-20
Donations:
http://www.eevblog.com/donations/
Projects:
http://www.eevblog.com/projects/
Electronics Info Wiki:
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Done.
Yeah but just think over a 20 year period you can save enough money to buy a solar roadways hoodie. Thunderfoot 2018 ( I think!!)
The end game is to be carbon neural ( CO2 from panel manufacturing +concrete+construction – generated power CO2 offset ). Solar panels are very costly in terms of CO2 to manufacture, they are marginally carbon neutral. Concrete generates vast amounts of CO2 ! If used in a residential setup via a grid tie inverter they can be favorable, however if batteries are incorporated it is a financial and environmental disaster. Environmentalists need to get their heads out of their asses and smell the roses . The rest of the people just need the rarest of assets…. common sense.
Like most of these pipe dreams their are actually ways to make them work they just look nothing like describeed
For a value added solution for example, in extreme snow areas tbat have to be plowed 4 months out of the year, building a solar far over the road with the panels properly angled to the sun and to shed snow, then having a standard roadway underneath that is perfected from the massive temperature swings, salt, water thats freezing and thawing…. The end result would be a benefit greater than the power produced and utilize standards road solution so people arent driving on glass(absurdity)
Solar oceans are the way to go, do the math!
The answer is simple, to make it payback electricity has to be priced 1000x higher
So the road would payback itself in 30 yearsinstead of 15. I wonder what 30 years of wear loojs like lmao
Germany is only producing around 8% of their energy w/ solar panels. And around 25% using coal plants. If you want to know how enviromently friendly they are just type "Tagebau Garzweiler" into google and see for your self! I'm austrian my self and we're producing around 60% by hydroelectric. I love germany for lots of things but regarding electricity production they're all but great!
Great approach. IMHO you are going a bit wrong from about 11.00 min: it has to be 26400Wh/day, resulting in 70m2 (you mention that), and the practically used surface is 70-1,75=131m2, roughly double the amount needed for powering 3 houses. So the payback time (joke, of course) should be calculated using this figure instead of the 70m2 you are using, resulting in a mere 775 years.
They're just building these solar roads wrong. The ideal construction puts the solar panels about 5m above the cycling/walking surface. On larger roads with motorized vehicles, it might be a good idea to aim higher, maybe 10m, because vehicles might be taller. It keeps out the rain. Shades the people beneath from the sun. And you don't have to slip on top of the glass.
You did not account for losses due to traffic and/or idiots blocking the sun.
The one thing to take away from this is that all these hysteria side effects about man-made climate change and what goes along with it has become a religion. Their believers can’t be rationally argued with. It’s all like: don’t show me data, I have already made up my mind! And btw, they seem to be bad at math 😂😂😂 . Thank You for sharing this video!
There are plenty of rooftops that are unused that would probably equate to as much (or More surface area) than using roadways.
Everyone knows solar roadways would only work correctly on Flat Earth.
Thanks for the pay back calculations and mentioning that it would take 1500 years to pay back – and pointing out that it was a R&D effort. Lets assume that it is order of magnitude for a take up. the it would have to last 150y. In my experience 15-25 y is respected return and that is 2 orders of magnitude. You also neglected a return on alternative investment for the same amount of R&D Cash a problem I experienced in CSIRO. It looks something like this: "If you invested the same amount in cash market you would get a better return on your investment"what BS. If most of us practical R&D people got up in morning and thought like that we would never get up to do R&D.
I did like Solar Constant of 1000W/m^2 – that is what hits the ground on Earth at optimum condition ( Radiation perpendicular to the penal – ok "sun overhead", the bugger moves. 🙂 . I keep telling people that is expression of energy that is ( source). They do not listen well – that includes csiro management that funded crazy solar projects., that is non practical management. Some of us can work with statictical mathematics to predict the output given all the probabilities but it will never be 100%.
Good work !!! I been telling people for years. But your Blog does it well
PS I like your HP41CVX, had one after HP19c I sold it to buy HP75c. but then settled on HP11C still have it.
Keep up the good work I like your calling BS its done with a style.
I think the biggest problem people are having understanding this…. is they can't understand the distinction between "It works" and "It's viable".
I don't know why'd even want it to work. You'd still be increasing the risk and consequences of accidents.
A payback period of 1545 years sounds like a government funded project alright.
100% renewable energy is 100% bullshit. Why don't we stop throwing money at these things and invest it something that works the same or better than fossil fuels? Here's a fact that you won't see on the news, manufacturing wind turbines releases more carbon in the atmosphere than they actually save during the entire life cycle of the fucking wing turbine! These pipe dreams cannot change the laws of physics.
Love the shirt.