Dave goes nuts over dodgy product design decisions in Canon DV camcorders, Fluke multimeters, Timex watches, Princeton Tec LED lights, and PVR's.
And how cool would it be to design farting gnomes?
29 thoughts on “Eevblog #28 – product design drives me nuts!”
I took a semester of product design at an art school and the biggest lesson I learned was. It doesn't matter how good the product is, all that matters is looks. You have to find a team of designers and engineers to get something decent.
Not all designs are bad. I dropped it after that semester and I've been trying to make decent stuff myself.
I feel your pain on the lights for sure! I have a wonderfully bright flashlight but my main gripe about it is the same as your bicycle light. You have to cycle through 4 more modes to turn the darn thing off, so frustrating.
When it comes to product design the road to failure is paved with expediency. The title "product engineer" isn't given to anyone who's competent – they won't last on the job….
Hey! You just don't get it! That kind of dedicated keys on a calc makes you look and feel smarter, even if you actually don't use all this stuff. It's priceless.
Just a rant from an engineer who can't see past his own small bubble. Most of the "bad" design you show has an easy explanation. "I don't get it" is NOT the same as "it' bad".
Why the hell do Multimeters auto turn off anyway? They all do it as if it's a feature that everyone wants! I find it the most annoying thing…. If I wanted it to turn off, then I would just turn it off… Just as you turn your head to read the meter with the back lighting turns off or the whole thing bloody turns off… And also… Why don't manufacturers make version's of their products that are more practical and productive for certain professions, for example,, the calculator! Sure they make an engineering calculator but how about one specific to electronic engineering…. How about a multimeter that is geard more towards audio electronics… Imagine having a multimeter that you can simply connect to get an accurate power output in rms and peak! I have seen someone getting watts rms reading directly from a bench multimeter which I think is an amazing feature but I didn't see how the person setup the meter… It's just might make a good tutorial Dave… Is it even possible to measure amplifier output with a multimeter… Everyone else usually will use an oscilloscope but if it's possible on a bench multimeter, then maybe it's possible on the handheld multimeter also?
I would bet you that these design decisions were simply cut corners on cost. During the prototyping phase, the engineers cooked something up strictly for testing and it served their purposes. Then a decision is made later in the design phase to just go to market with it.
Designed obsolesence, digital cables (??), auto power off, 4 inch woofers, directional patch cables (come-on), break in periods, tube superiority, phono circuitry removed (Bluetooth added), all the new audio gear, Audio-Grade capaciators, coils, and resistors, AC power conditioners, speaker wire elevated on dixie cups, . . . . cell phones. The Navy can't even fire their weapons if the computers go out !!!!!
I loathe the bright blue LED's that almost every tech manufacturer feels the need to include in every product they make.
I recently got a new router, when shopping around any router covered in overly bright blue LED's was immediately disqualified. Sure, that information can be useful for diagnostics, but I do not need annoying flickering lights on all the time.
Blue in itself is also problematic because it actually messes with our circadian rhythm, blue light inhibits the production of melanin, an hormone involved in sleep. a charger with a bright blue light in your bedroom actually actively makes your sleep worse.
I blame sci-fi, everything is always covered in blue lights, so tech companies, wishing their products to look futuristic put them wherever they can. Most products could go without them or make due with low-powered ones in neat colours that don't mess with our sleep.
It's usually just design by committee. There's never enough resources to create a perfect product, because eventually everything needs to get shipped. On the camera, I can imagine that touch screen for the pause an play button was last minute enough to not give the software guys enough time to program, test, troubleshoot, and repeat that process for getting the info, and the play button working perfectly. Therefore management decided that the info wasn't as important as the play button, and just ship a minimal viable product. As for the hyp function, maybe the guy who designed it way back in the day really thought it would come in handy, but then when it comes to redesigning the calculator the amount of people who care enough about calculator layout that it's a make or brake buying decision is so few that the cost of redesigning the button layout doesn't make sense.
And no, this doesn't make these products poorly made. There's so much more that goes into product design than just your run-of-the-mill "does it work" questions. Clients and bosses who can't be bothered to stretch the budget, profit margins, schedules, and employee fulfillment all play far more into real product design and what makes a good product. Granted, good on everyone here who actually takes the time to learn what good and solid design is, that is the sign of a great engineer. But a great engineer is not just able to design well, but is cognizant of what is expected of them, and furthermore cognizant of how they're work impacts the company as a whole.
Source – Electrical product engineer taking residence in Seattle Washington, USA
Yes, totally agree! Every calculator I like needs and have a dedicated 1/x button – HP48SX – the only one. And of course no dedicated hyp button. Thanks! 😉
Audio amplifiers always have heat problems: *hot components are always placed next to electrolytic capacitors *heat sinks add shipping/material weight and don't look sleek *fans are frowned upon because they create unwanted noise (which gets drowned out by the speakers) *components running near their thermal limits in "normal" operation is acceptable
I don't think the people that design most things use them. He designs a Chevy and drives a Ford home. Things are too stupid and you don't have to be an engineer to realize how stupid they are.
The range switch on the Fluke is designed that way to prevent accidental shorts. Imagine accidentally frying a $1200 ECU because you were in the wrong mode. Can't even drive to the store to buy another after! 😀
Omg yes the blue led spotlights blaring in your face – that fad has to die! My new product startup process: Plug-in, turn-on, get tiny square of electrical tape to cover up damn blinding blue led.
On the topic of the Princeton Tec lights. I work as a millright, essentially a mix of industrial mechanical maintenance and industrial machine installation. I was working a longer term job at a local John Deere foundry and bought a headlight for my hardhat. It was a Princeton Tec product. I believe it was designed for people doing general outdoors activities and not the industrial worker. I really loved this light. Nice and bright, great battery life, and multiple light intensity modes that worked great depending on what I was working on and ambient lighting. This light did not have the issue that you showed with the bike light. It had 4 modes plus off if I remember correct with a single button for mode selection that just cycled through. If you left it on any setting for more than 10 seconds, the next click of the button turned it off.
I took a semester of product design at an art school and the biggest lesson I learned was.
It doesn't matter how good the product is, all that matters is looks. You have to find a team of designers and engineers to get something decent.
Not all designs are bad. I dropped it after that semester and I've been trying to make decent stuff myself.
No specther inglesh, my inglesh is tecnical !
Chinese manufacturing.. Cutting coners and as long as it works it's ok.
"The Algorithm" recycling some good stuff!
I feel your pain on the lights for sure! I have a wonderfully bright flashlight but my main gripe about it is the same as your bicycle light. You have to cycle through 4 more modes to turn the darn thing off, so frustrating.
When it comes to product design the road to failure is paved with expediency. The title "product engineer" isn't given to anyone who's competent – they won't last on the job….
Hey! You just don't get it! That kind of dedicated keys on a calc makes you look and feel smarter, even if you actually don't use all this stuff. It's priceless.
Just a rant from an engineer who can't see past his own small bubble. Most of the "bad" design you show has an easy explanation. "I don't get it" is NOT the same as "it' bad".
Why the hell do Multimeters auto turn off anyway? They all do it as if it's a feature that everyone wants! I find it the most annoying thing…. If I wanted it to turn off, then I would just turn it off… Just as you turn your head to read the meter with the back lighting turns off or the whole thing bloody turns off… And also… Why don't manufacturers make version's of their products that are more practical and productive for certain professions, for example,, the calculator! Sure they make an engineering calculator but how about one specific to electronic engineering…. How about a multimeter that is geard more towards audio electronics… Imagine having a multimeter that you can simply connect to get an accurate power output in rms and peak! I have seen someone getting watts rms reading directly from a bench multimeter which I think is an amazing feature but I didn't see how the person setup the meter… It's just might make a good tutorial Dave… Is it even possible to measure amplifier output with a multimeter… Everyone else usually will use an oscilloscope but if it's possible on a bench multimeter, then maybe it's possible on the handheld multimeter also?
I would bet you that these design decisions were simply cut corners on cost. During the prototyping phase, the engineers cooked something up strictly for testing and it served their purposes. Then a decision is made later in the design phase to just go to market with it.
And couldn't they have made the cheap chinese transistor tester so you wouldn't have to re-boot for every test ????????
Designed obsolesence, digital cables (??), auto power off, 4 inch woofers, directional patch cables (come-on), break in periods, tube superiority, phono circuitry removed (Bluetooth added), all the new audio gear, Audio-Grade capaciators, coils, and resistors, AC power conditioners, speaker wire elevated on dixie cups, . . . . cell phones. The Navy can't even fire their weapons if the computers go out !!!!!
Funny that you now have two multimeters of your own design with rotary on/off
I loathe the bright blue LED's that almost every tech manufacturer feels the need to include in every product they make.
I recently got a new router, when shopping around any router covered in overly bright blue LED's was immediately disqualified. Sure, that information can be useful for diagnostics, but I do not need annoying flickering lights on all the time.
Blue in itself is also problematic because it actually messes with our circadian rhythm, blue light inhibits the production of melanin, an hormone involved in sleep. a charger with a bright blue light in your bedroom actually actively makes your sleep worse.
I blame sci-fi, everything is always covered in blue lights, so tech companies, wishing their products to look futuristic put them wherever they can. Most products could go without them or make due with low-powered ones in neat colours that don't mess with our sleep.
You are a winy git
Now in 2018 I am asking Dave: Why 121GW multimeter does not have on/off button!? Ahhh!??? 😉
It's usually just design by committee. There's never enough resources to create a perfect product, because eventually everything needs to get shipped. On the camera, I can imagine that touch screen for the pause an play button was last minute enough to not give the software guys enough time to program, test, troubleshoot, and repeat that process for getting the info, and the play button working perfectly. Therefore management decided that the info wasn't as important as the play button, and just ship a minimal viable product.
As for the hyp function, maybe the guy who designed it way back in the day really thought it would come in handy, but then when it comes to redesigning the calculator the amount of people who care enough about calculator layout that it's a make or brake buying decision is so few that the cost of redesigning the button layout doesn't make sense.
And no, this doesn't make these products poorly made. There's so much more that goes into product design than just your run-of-the-mill "does it work" questions. Clients and bosses who can't be bothered to stretch the budget, profit margins, schedules, and employee fulfillment all play far more into real product design and what makes a good product. Granted, good on everyone here who actually takes the time to learn what good and solid design is, that is the sign of a great engineer. But a great engineer is not just able to design well, but is cognizant of what is expected of them, and furthermore cognizant of how they're work impacts the company as a whole.
Source – Electrical product engineer taking residence in Seattle Washington, USA
Yes, totally agree! Every calculator I like needs and have a dedicated 1/x button – HP48SX – the only one. And of course no dedicated hyp button. Thanks! 😉
wasn't there something about the dangers of looking directly into the light from high brightness leds ?
Audio amplifiers always have heat problems:
*hot components are always placed next to electrolytic capacitors
*heat sinks add shipping/material weight and don't look sleek
*fans are frowned upon because they create unwanted noise (which gets drowned out by the speakers)
*components running near their thermal limits in "normal" operation is acceptable
Blue LEDs are the worst. I will not buy a product with blue LEDs on the face. Bring back the red LED, please.
Most bike lights I've seen are like that. I always thought it was annoying too but i guess they're cutting costs.
I don't think the people that design most things use them. He designs a Chevy and drives a Ford home. Things are too stupid and you don't have to be an engineer to realize how stupid they are.
Why did we study hyperbolic functions in college? Are they useless? Who uses them? Just curious.
The range switch on the Fluke is designed that way to prevent accidental shorts. Imagine accidentally frying a $1200 ECU because you were in the wrong mode. Can't even drive to the store to buy another after! 😀
Omg yes the blue led spotlights blaring in your face – that fad has to die! My new product startup process: Plug-in, turn-on, get tiny square of electrical tape to cover up damn blinding blue led.
I feel the same way.
I actually wonder,, if anyone likes bright blue led front of pc,
On the topic of the Princeton Tec lights. I work as a millright, essentially a mix of industrial mechanical maintenance and industrial machine installation. I was working a longer term job at a local John Deere foundry and bought a headlight for my hardhat. It was a Princeton Tec product. I believe it was designed for people doing general outdoors activities and not the industrial worker. I really loved this light. Nice and bright, great battery life, and multiple light intensity modes that worked great depending on what I was working on and ambient lighting. This light did not have the issue that you showed with the bike light. It had 4 modes plus off if I remember correct with a single button for mode selection that just cycled through. If you left it on any setting for more than 10 seconds, the next click of the button turned it off.