Dave tears down the Keithley 617 Electrometer, capable of measuring sub-femtoamp (attoamps!) resolution.
Low Level Measurement Handbook: http://www.tek.com/sites/tek.com/files/media/document/resources/LowLevelHandbook_7Ed.pdf
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Hi. This is the Keithley DMM 7510. It's a pretty Schmick seven and a half digit multimeter. One of the best you can get.
So if we can have a look at what can measure in terms of low current, well, of its lowest range. Here, our decimal point is here on the micro amps range. Move the decimal place three spots over and that's Nano. Amps move at three spots over again and that's Pico amps.
So it basically has one Pico amp resolution. Pretty Schmick. But yeah, this is amateur hour. This is what you want when you're measuring low currents.
Thirty-five-year-old technology. The Keithley Six One Seven programmable electronic from the early 1980s. This is a fantastic bit of kit. Not only can it measure voltage, it can measure owns, thank you very much.
Giga Ohms Hundreds of Giga Ohms. If you want to go that high, it can measure coulombs for those playing along at home. Everyone loves cool loans and it can measure current. How low can it go? Well, how high can it go? Well, look at this milliamps.
No worries. Micro amps, No worries. keep going. Ah, keep going.
Ha. Nano answer that's very mature speak: OS That's for amateurs - let's have a look. Its lowest range is a 2 Pico amp range. and that's Pico amps.
That's puff. So there's our decimal point if you move. Oh sorry, you can't really. Black pointers hopeless in there.
There's a decimal place three places over that digit. There is Femto amps. This one here is 100 800 amps at Oh. Most people don't even learn what a doe is in engineering.
It's like her, what prefix is that? A hundred at Oh amps resolution? Now pretty much there's only a couple of instruments that can. well that like mainstream instruments that I'm aware of that can beat this these days. There are a couple of modern ones that can go down to ten at AU amps resolution, but this one can. 200 @o amps.
Absolutely amazing. Thirty-five-year-old better technology for those playing along at home. that is 62.5 electrons per second for a hundred at AU amps. Whoa.
This is heavy. So what do you need something like this for? Well, basic our physics and material research. New nano tube research, new polymers and various other like you know, real low current electrochemical type applications. we pretty much down to the level of counting electrons.
It's ridiculous. Anyway, a hundred at of's resolution and please excuse me for turning it on before I take it apart. but I just have to show you that how low this thing could actually go and yeah we can. this is the actual I haven't got nothing plugged into it at the moment and we can actually do well.
There we go I had it on zero there but there we go. it's actually counting. If you fart on the other side of the room this thing's going to change by like a hundred counts. So I'm clenching my butt cheeks just I've been not breathe either more.
Anyway look we can zero check that and it's got an internal - an internal one femto ab offset there and we can zero it. Well we can zero correct that before we take our measurement. Unbelievable! Now it's actually got a voltage source output as well. voltage generator 103 volts maximum very nice for are powering stuff under test that allows a higher resistance mode as well using the building voltage source and also it's got awesome monitor outputs as well so you can actually we'll have a closer look at the schematic up there, but it's got the obligatory I Triple E, 4w, G P Ib interface and it's also got outputs which tell you that the the completion of the measurement has done an external trigger as well so you can trigger it and then it gives a response when it's taken that measurements. So good for our system integration. So you can see that you can actually get a preamp put here and also an amplified analog output as well and that might be handy for once again system integration stuff. Now of course you can't just use a regular B and C or banana Jack inputs for this sort of thing. you've got to use a special low noise tri-axial connector.
It's called. it's called tri-axial because it looks like a regular BNC which is basically a biaxial and this is actually got a third contact in there, that goal one around there if you can see that closely. So don't just go plug in a regular BNC cable into a tri-axial connector. you'll bugger it up.
so this actually provides a separate internal shield in there as like different for like internal guard different from the external output here and that's critical for really lows noise measurements. but you'll also find them on very high resistance meters as well once designed and once again they're ultra low carb but like thousand very high voltage system. high resistance meters for example, will actually use these tri-axial connectors for testing at a thousand volts. And you know you can pay like a thousand dollars for a test cable that comes with this instrument.
But considering that one of these modern instruments is like seven thousand dollars for the base model unit and like fifteen thousand dollars for the for the top-of-the-range model, then you know people are used to paying a thousand bucks for a special low noise tri-axial cable. Oh, manufactured by Nude Virgins now unfortunately. I don't have a tri-axial connector here in the lab handily. I could all have to order one so they can.
done you know, do some better experiment. So I'll just plug some shop probes up as quacker and I'll see if it's being on. Let's have a look here We go: hung at the right angle like that being on that is the least significant digit. Awesome! So I'm not going to go to the effort at the moment to measure all the other ranges That you require specialized our setups to do, but suffice to say that if it's being on on the 1 million odds of it being good on the other Rangers our high confidence is high and check it out the building voltage generator. It works as well. so let's set it to 5 volts shall we? There you go. It's only a smidgen out, but this can actually go up to as I said a hundred odd volts is. I Actually will have an adjustable velocity thing so should get there reasonably quick.
Tada there it is under 0.45 Not bad at all, so basic functionality seems to be there. Awesome! And I Love gear that has the instructions on the top. Look at that! Beautiful. Why can't they do that these days? And you wait? Let's do a teardown on this puppy and into the world of ASO And I This is going to be interesting.
So what we're going to see inside here is I'm guessing this isn't just going to be running Virant The cow acts just across the cable over to the PCB It's going to be going into a nice big shielded block or something like that. There's two screws on the back, the rest of its of course all going to be regular our stuff. There's just going to be some magic on the on the front end and look, Yep, we're in like Flynn And Tada, There it is. There's our magic block.
That's where the magic is going to happen. And for the external power supply over here, that's hilarious. In fact, all that transformer is it. It's bent.
That is not camera angle. That's not my I got a wonky, but Transformers do. These things can I bend it back. Geez.
Check out. down in the mains input down here. Look at this. It's right near these signal outputs.
Look, not a single toss was given about making it. You know, aesthetically, physically separate from the rest of it. But you know, as long as you've got your clearance on the PCB, it's all hunky-dory So what they're doing is running the mains traces down here's little common mode choke. They're running them right down the edge of the board, right past all the active circuitry.
Once again, if the clearances there okay, but you know it's not exactly modern design technique. And then they've got the the mains. real clunker mains power switch on the front. They're not sure that puppy's doing there.
it's not labeled. you have to read the manual on that one. Hmm. Anyway, so I've got our mains input and then our line fuses next to that.
Oh, and the Motorola 6800 Five fanboys go wild There it is in socketed, thank you very much. And then we've got the obligatory SRAM next to that I can't read that? What is over? Yeah, it's six, Double one, six. Of course. it is absolutely classic.
And then we've just got our basic rom. So of course 65, a 60 805 processor and the TMS 99 one four up here. This is actually the GPIB interface chip and you can can't have tell because it's plugged into all the micro on the bus and then they all bugger off up here. Got some drivers and then it goes over to the GPIB connector.
sorry I Triple E fault I'm late so we've got our decode there 85 There it is and yet some of the other chips down there 85 I'm not going to give any cares about all the digital stuff, not me I Want to see what's inside the can and we've got some AC coupling to the chassis of course for a raft system noise reasons, just a couple on there. Look at the braids they've got in there, by the way. Little pro tip: When you're using your solder wick, don't throw away. you use solder wick actually. I Keep them in. You're paying off cuts from those keeping your pass drawer. They're very useful for really low impedance. Are straps like this one? It probably doesn't need the low impedance somebody's put the strap in there, but yeah, it can be useful.
Keep them know some of the glue is starting to peel off there. Look at that. That's they've got a shield all the way. You know the entire box is are shielded as you'd expect on an instrument of this class and it looks like the board in here.
it's all going to be, you know, through-hole stuff just like this, but it looks like they got it on the one board with the power supply over here. This is of course a dedicated analog power supply for this analog section. The other transformer down year has got its own stuff for all the digital thing that makes sense to what separate those, but again, it looks like they've got it all on the one board and calibrated by 1065. Good on your 1065 and inspected by 1300.
Some of the unsung heroes of Keithley wonder where they are now. All right, let's reveal the magic here. A couple of tremor holes up there. You're going to trim those at the riot right angle.
You're not allowed to probe through there unless you've got your tongue at the right angle and you've got a gray beard. So let's check in today. Whoa. Got some Jersey stuff going on here.
With this care, we'll take a closer look, but of course, what you expect to find in one of these things is exactly what we see standoffs here. There is too much leakage on PCBs for this sort of stuff to be going into. PCBs So we've got ridiculously low leakage relays here. We'll have to check that amp.
Let's see if I can can't even get a brand et phone home Anyway, what'd you expect PCBs have too much leakage. They get crap, contaminants, oil, dust, and condensation, all sorts of crap on them. so you want point-to-point wiring on this sort of stuff. Teflon Standoffs.
Oh maybe no maybe they're not Teflon because Teflon can actually build up a static charge and that can be a trap for young players. but ya can see our input is going directly over here over to the standoff there into these transform into these relays which are doing the range switching. and have you ever seen a 250 gig on not mega and Giga ohm resister before? Well you have. Now that's the impedance of this thing by the looks of it.
Now on a quick search: I Didn't find anything for these relays here, but I'll have a better look if I can I'll include it. These are going to be ridiculously low leakage hermetically sealed relays now I've actually done a video on talking about one of the designs I did back in the day for a company I worked out where it was a once again measuring high resistances and high voltages and we required a relay matrix in like a massive relay. Matrix Hundreds and hundreds of relays and all the problems involved in actually designing one of those things. It's one of my very old videos from most seven eight years ago. I'll link it in down below and at the end of this video, check it out and whatever that little metal can there is, it's very important because they didn't want the metal can just flapping around in the breeze, so they had to actually have a strap tying that down to some sort of a guard point. It's probably not going to be ground, it's going to be a guard point. There is a difference between ground and guide point. I Might have to do a separate video on that because that's kind of an interesting topic in its own.
Right now, you might be able to notice down in there. Oh maybe not. Might be a bit hard, but all the magic of course is happening in our jewel fit matched fit pair. here.
you can see that one of the leads just in there bugger go into the PCBU way too much leakage and whatnot. So it goes. They bent it out at right angles like that, directly to the standoff so you can see that the signal path comes in here from the coax and then it goes through the various relays and then goes to you know, various input impedances and stuff like that to get the current. Of course, because we're measuring current, we're going to transport it through a resistant measure the voltage across it.
basically. So we've got the fixed and here's the fixed are 250 gig resistor here so that would be used for the two Pico ampere range there and that is directly on that no there. So everything travels above the board's like you know, Manhattan-style above the board's Manhattan construction technique which is a technique of dead bugging components on copper clad board and then just point-to-point wiring might include a photo if there is one and yet so it all stays off the PCB and goes directly into our jewel matched fit there which of course is going to be a super duper special matched characterized one manufactured by nude virgins with gray beads. See if we can get the part number on that.
it's got a one, six eight, then an eight-five to a on their hmm and T - TG on the front of that and it em so it's not, doesn't look like the motor. all a job anyway so I can pull up any data on that putt. I doubt it like you know this could be a Keithley internal part number. You may not know what that jewel fat input is anyway if you blow the ice out of that, oh yeah, good luck it the new one.
So are you young whippersnappers out there? probably going here? What's the big deal? Like it's got some realizing and jewel fit. Important bloody fancy pantsy tri-axial connected but whoop-dee-doo Um, will he go try and design something like this? Go try it, design it, test it, and then get you know a proper controlled are characteristics in production environment and you'll find out very quickly how difficult this is to get right. It's not rocket science, its electron science and you'll notice that the grounds are going all over the shop. Not only did did the shield here for this matched fit bugger off to somewhere else over here to some guard ground. but what? Some guide terminal doesn't have to be ground, but the shielding for this case up here which is isolated from, well, supposed to be touching there isn't it. Did that cause an issue? All right, Like that. Eventually touching there cause an issue, it may it may do. I don't know.
Hmm. Anyway, that like this ground is bearing off somewhere else a shield for this is Berggren or somewhere else the tri-axial I presume that that green wire in there is going into the tri-axial shield guard inside there. so it's buggering off downstairs somewhere which we don't know about and it's getting all this stuff right is not easy. Anyway, I'm got ourselves a Kodak hybrid resistor network there, so that's pretty nice.
But apart from that, you know we've got. What? The 250 gig resistors? They're not going to be cheetah, hundred Megara, No 100. Then we've got 100 gig, but 100 gig, 50 gig resistor and other. There's a hundred Meg one in there and various other.
Yep, there is special hundred Meg one there you go for the different ranges they're going down in decades of course to give you your different ranges there. the shunt resistors just like on a micro current for example, except it uses a fancy pantsy FET front end and really high value resistors. It's simply the voltage cross and the foliage drop across a resistor. But yeah, it really is a super duper special, huh? If we get down in there having fully removed the board yet, but check out yeah, the tri-axial god is coming from that point down there, as is the shield for the can.
So it looks like as are two different wires buggering off there, buggering off somewhere else on the board. We've got ourselves a star ground in point there, so it's all referenced back to that one point. so they certainly know what they're doing. And here's the circuitry underneath there.
So that's actually all to do with like the 100 volt high-voltage power supply over here. and take a look at this and notice something interesting. Look at this big strap over here. this big crimp connector.
There's from the hundred volt output over here. They've got that going through what looks like in our massive high current day lead. It's not doing that. it's going over to this capacitor here, which then couples into the ground and that ground is on the output, which straps into which has an optional strode to the earth ground which then straps optionally into the output ground over here. And of course, whether or not you include that ground guard strap, there is all to do with your system implementation and how you do that. so you have to really know what you're doing when you're playing around. You know, implementing this sort of stuff and taking serious measurements. not in terms of using the instrument, but your system setup and all your system grounding and things like that.
It's really important and huh? Looks like those are extra system ground wires that Star Grounding I told you about is going over here. Looks like one of them is going into the main ribbon cable which then goes back up to the main connector at the top of the main analog input board at the top. And thankfully we have full access to the schematics for this thing and all the theory of operation the whole works. I'll link in the manual down below.
The regular manual has the all this stuff in it. It's not just the service manual that you know you used to be able to get, it's all in the main manual. Fantastic that make them like this anymore. Anyway, take a look at the notes that they've got for just assembling this.
PCB look free, unclean the PCB flow and touch up using Rosin flux wash immediately after this slower flow in Freon. sort of the polystyrene capacitors and polystyrene. Thumbs up! Love polystyrene. This super are stable I Super stable capacitors used for you know, high precision circuits like this one.
After the freon, you're going to do that after the freon wash and then remove flux locally with freon and then clean thoroughly with methanol after a flow and touch-up in dust areas. What components mounted on Teflon so they are actually tap on standoffs? That's interesting so our static mustn't be a problem case. We know what they're doing and must not touch PC board or other components because if they have to be completely also isolated. So here you go.
It's just like assembly steps. That's just great. And we have the schematic for the ad converter as well. Know it says they've rolled their own analog to digital converter.
It's a constant frequency, charge balance, single slope job and well you can do it's. got theory of operation in the manual if you want to go into that. But yeah that basically I roll their own. It's not like they just bought metal devices a DC Now bugger that.
And of course this is what everyone wants to see. the front end. How do they do this? How do they get like a totally 100 at oh mmm to amp levels on this thing? Well let's take a look. the Input: as you can see you can see that the guard.
they're the three inputs and the guard as I said goes down to mates down to the motherboard. so it's all it goes around in. you know, various configurations for that star ground and all that. If you we see that there are different symbols used for the different ground there and look over on the right-hand side near K 301 over there that relay, you can see that that's actually a star ground point and that might go back to the main board that we actually saw back down the bottom. that star ground point down on the bottom PCB So as we've seen in the teardown, it doesn't go to the PCB at this point, it's all off the board construction that input signal goes to. Those are those rows of standoffs and those relays that we actually saw there with the you know it's just up in free air so it's not touching the board so it's completely isolated. Air gapped, isolated from everything goes into those special Squirrel relays which I still can't find any data on those, but they'd be ridiculously low leakage and you can see that are If you go through our 3, 3, 4, 3, 5, 5 & 3 3 2 there, then you can see the 250 Giga ohm resistor permanently going down to ground. So that's like 250 gig ohms as that permanent input resistance there and then the other ones at the top there.
Right at the very top, there's 100 Gig are 330 there and then 331 100 Meg. Then they'll go down in decades, 100 K and so forth for the various ranges. Now, of course, this isn't those. don't go down the ground, they're part of the feedback loop, part of the feedback amplifier.
And of course, if you look at the theory of operation, this is actually a feedback amplifier. So the the shunt resistor in quote marks the resistor that the current needs to flow through converted to voltage is in the feedback loop of the Op Amp and the Op Amp. Here you can see it there. you 309 is actually a linear technology LT 101 too.
and that's a pretty schmick Op amp. but it's only Pico amp level input right? so it's not good. Not Pico ants for that's you know that's amateur hour. So they use Q 308 the dual match J FET input as the high impedance and input required to get the At O Amp level.
So this is a very special matched transistor. can't probably hand-selected hand tested it, hand graded everything else, and I looked in the manual departs list for it. and yet they don't actually give a part number, so you know it's super special. Secret Squirrel stuff.
Presumably, if anyone does know, please tell us down below. Anyway, that is what gives you your extremely ridiculously high input impedance. The only thing they can do the job here is J Fence. Now this MOSFET rubbish.
Like really special matched. J FETs There for the front end. But apart from that, that's where all the magic happens. and physically as well, where the magic happens.
It's all off the board choosing these components like the match J FET like the relays mounting them off the board, but everything else is just pretty much off-the-shelf The LT 101, 2 and u 304 up the top there. whatever that is, they've got to vote six point, three fold voltage reference our Zener and you know, like the rest of it's pretty ordinary stuff really. So yeah, all the special stuff transistor real A Manhattan construction that's the ticket lady. So there you have it. I Hope you enjoyed that interesting look inside the Keithley Six One Seven electrometer and these things. They're still available for all sorts of physics and materials research and all sorts of we in wonderful stuff don't have much use in the regular electronics of course they might be using our semiconductor you know, fabs and other places for various things, but you know you general-purpose electronic lab is not going to need to go down to a tow amps I like this thing can or even Femto amps really so you know you might go. Pico Amps You know, nano amps is quite common for low power stuff, but you know, even Pico answers like usually several orders of magnitude beyond what your regular electronics person ever needs to deal with. But these things are very specialized.
It's a kit, they have their place. that's why they're so expensive. You know, having the matched FET front-end and all the special relays and everything else you know. And they don't manufacture these in high volume which is why that they can charge.
you know, Seven, eight, ten, fifteen thousand dollars for these sorts of things. They are precision bits of kit. Lots of engineering goes into them, but you might look it and go home. You know, me? whatever.
but there's a try and do it. I dare you try and measure you know hundreds of Giga ohms tera ohms and femto amps and @om so it's just crazy different world Anyway, if you liked it, please be give it a big thumbs up. As always they're high res are tear down photos on eevblog com LinkedIn down below if you want to discuss it. Comments: all that sort of stuff link of the Eevblog for him.
hope you liked it. Catch you next time you.
sorry Dave i have to correct you on this there not nude virgins there "vestal virgins" as not to confuse them with garden variety "inga's"
I have a University Degree in physics. I saw an electrometer ONCE during my time in education and that was for ONE CLASS when I was in high school.
Great device – just got one from ebay with some differences. The Triax was missing – someone took it out, but looks liek he was careful doing it as the screws are back in the case with a hole left. Also the Jfet was replaced by a smaller one and the shielding removed, maybe a keithley repair ? Or a repair attempt. The devices powers on so far, but I now need to replace the triax, got one not the same mounting but should fit and have to rewire, the original has a plug for the hot seide, so I have to find a similar connector dont want to solder it to the chain — hope I get it back to life and nothing else was broken especially the jfet part is very suspect. The device was sold as working but untested (the seller dont know much about technique as the missing triax would have needed a defective selling not working) – But I saw this and the price was ok for this.
I kept hearing jewel matched JFET wondering what that might be. Took me a while to realise it was dual not jewel. 😳
femto
Please make a video on Ground and guard difference and its importance….
Hi Dave.
The tag or label "Do not touch the circuit board" is because 74CHxxx ICs are actually CMOS ICs and touching the circuit board could potentially zap them due to electro-static dischrges.
First saw Kerry Wong using one of these and thought to myself yep, I'm getting one until I saw the price 🤣
Yeah I bet farts are more conductive.
👍👍
The transformer is crooked on purpose. We used to build audio equipment, and to avoid interfecence, you have to align the transformer in strange angles some times.
Of course everybody loves COOL OHMS. =P It's funny though I remember a prof once saying we would very rarely if ever, deal with coulombs. Which I dunno where he's been, but it doesn't seem like they're that uncommon. Fairly large as a unit compared to most applications, sure. But far from uncommon.
That vintage electrometer looks just like chocolate… Now I'm hungry.
why dont you make a computer run on that and solve the super computer energy crisis?
"one attoamp
(1×10–18A) corresponds to just six electrons." Holy crap! Imagine counting individual electrons as they pass by!
amazing
You misunderstand the purpose of the guard shield in the triaxial cable and connectors. This conducting tube is held at the same potential (voltage) as the inner conductor so that no current will flow away from the inner conductor. Only vacuum is a perfect insulator so any potential difference will cause the current we need to measure to leak through the insulation.
What's with that Q311 on the schematic? Both collectors are N.C. – does that form some sort of a thermally-coupled single-silicon paired back-to-back clamping diode? What!
exa
peta
tera
giga
mega
kilo
hecto
deca
deci
centi
milli
micro
nano
pico
famto
atto
Nice strip-down, I am adding one of these to my own lab today 🙂
EEVblog: Thank you, thank you, thank you for this video. You've explained why my measurements were off. I used the non-nude virgins cable !! (or was it the nude-non-virgins? I forget.) It was as simple as that ! Once I got the right cables, everything measured as expected. Thank you again!
Tera ohms are cool but what about peta ohms
Enjoyed the video. In a former life, we dealt with femto-ammeters to read the current from ion-chamber radiation detectors for measuring reactor power. When operating in a different voltage range, instead of avalanche 'pulses' like a Geiger-Muller tube, get a steady femto-current. We had the preamps close to the detectors near the reactor. Getting those triax connectors on the cables just right, while crawling around the framework was a b****.
But, just so you know it was possible, we did it with TUBES. 🙂
this is amazing and funny
How many electrons are an atto Ampere?
I've got war stories from my electronics lab technician job (before and during my time at uni), including one about building a 13-decade logarithmic ammeter that started down at 10 fA (calibrated), that added 3 lower decades to an existing 10-decade system. The PhDs did the circuit physics, the EEs did the circuit design, but I had to build and test the prototype, calibrate it, push it through DFM (make it repeatable and stable), then write the build, test and tech manuals for it.
Counting electrons is totally nuts: They never wind up going where you want them to. I had to enclose my lab bench within a Faraday cage. I had to remove the anti-static mats, clean everything with Freon, alcohol and/or acetone to remove residue traces. Special cables, special solder, special flux; nothing was standard. I had to take many of my measurements remotely.
The signal source was a unique and ultra-sensitive "current chamber" radiation detector driven by high voltage (~12kV) that was located 100m away, meaning it was connected using ultra-low-leakage coax. A nightmare to develop and test in the lab. The cable capacitance alone was horrible to deal with.
Precision log amps are strange circuits. We put a matched Darlington pair in the feedback loop of a Burr-Brown instrumentation amplifier. Simple, right? Not when we had to surround it with bias and thermal corrections to maintain sensitivity and log-linearity. Which added circuit load, which meant I had to start my testing and calibration a full decade lower, at 1 fA. Which meant detecting down to 100 aA to ensure we could reliably measure 1 fA so we could repeatably calibrate from 10 fA. Ugh.
Once the prototype was working, I had to build 10 pre-production units for environmental and accelerated lifetime testing, to ensure the calibration held for the required time under all required conditions. Double-ugh.
My main technical contribution was to thermal stability: I replaced the heat sinks and thermal straps with a machined block of copper, to ensure the instrumentation amp and the Darlingtons were kept within a fraction of a degree of each other, so the thermal compensation circuits would always work as intended and the calibration would be stable. (We almost had to go to a temperature-stabilized oven, but that would have created a cascade of problems that could easily have made things worse overall.)
At the last minute they changed both the PCB conformal coating and the potting compound. Not something you want to do around calibrated low-leakage high-impedance circuits (despite the new compounds being better). To avoid complete retesting, I "handled" it by redesigning the heatsink to become a sealed box, keeping the new materials far away from my calibrated log amp.
While it was a ton of fun, it was this project that convinced me to switch my major from EE to CE (computer engineering), though I did keep an emphasis on sensor/signal processing.
Actually, being an embedded/real-time instrumentation software engineer who is also a fully qualified lab tech has proven to be an ideal career choice for me. I can prove to the EEs where and how they screwed up, but I don't have to fix it myself! Bwa-ha-ha-ha!