The magic smoke was released from my solar analytics monitoring system. What was the culprit?
Also Dumb Dave™ gets ZAPPED!
Forum: https://www.eevblog.com/forum/blog/eevblog-1511-my-solar-analytics-system-failed/
Solar Analytics install video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEqlOj6_m0Q
Weird current transformer arrangement: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2_mJtAeaog
00:00 - Solar Analytics monitoring system failure
01:58 - Contact probing mains voltage check
03:08 - Inside the infamous fuse box
04:11 - Bench teardown
04:36 - Hey, this thing rattles, WTF!
06:04 - Dumb Dave gets ZAPPED!
08:22 - The missing diode
09:51 - Yuck!
10:59 - The AMAZING resistor!
12:47 - For the MELF fanboys
14:16 - This Supercap looks suspicious...
17:09 - It spewed its guts
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#ElectronicsCreators #solar #fail

Hi I've had a fire on my Um Solar Analytics Monitoring system. First thing I noticed is that I got an email report saying um, you haven't We haven't received any data in a week just showing you my fuse panel again because everyone Marvels at this Wonder this ancient wonder. Um, even though it's not that ancient, it's like mid 80s Australian switchboard Anyway, they don't make them like this anymore. So anyway, here's the Solar Analytics system and of course I'll link in the video If you haven't seen it.

It's my monitoring system that monitors both my in-phase system, your newer end phase system and so that's that one there and uh, also my old Sunny Boy system as well because I've got two different solar power systems and this basically uh, combines the monitoring on both of those and it's dyed usually and this is actually a three-phase uh one. but I've only got a single phase here at the house and it does. Um, and the leads are out. The technical troubleshooting for this is foreign.

Have you tried turning it off and on again? Find that and I and I um yeah, I'm gonna. I'm gonna take that off and see what's right. In fact, I can show you on the back here. yeah, that's the wire there that's powering it.

So if I get the cover off, there's the mains input over there here and I haven't physically touched anything or nothing. looks like it's it's come out or anything like that and it's got a Phoenix block. There's the other side there with the current Transformers down in there, which I'm doing a weird um thing with those I'm actually uh, paralleling them up I've done a video on that, but let's measure the voltages on there, see if we're actually getting Mains input. Now here's where one of these magnetic hanger things would have come in handy.

Yes. I've got the original, uh, red. like there's just nowhere to conveniently put the meter. I'd like to just hang it.

Um, yeah, I'm gonna hang it on the side or something. and no, you can't get in there with a voltage detection stick. The one that I've got is just too sensitive. It just, you know, it can't discriminate.

This whole box is just spewing everything out and you can't detect an individual wire. So you've got to actually, uh, touch probe it. Well, I just remembered that this actually does have a probe option. So yep, there you go.

Yep, and yep. Well it turns out that is actually wired into the light circuit. so I didn't expect that I thought it'd be uh, you know, a PowerPoint circuit. There's no voltage on it now.

and if I re-cycle that, um, there's just no leads at all And it's not just a brightness daylight thing. He's dead Jim Is this a dead man? Doctor? Very dead Mr Spock He's dead. He's dead. Captain There you go.

That's pretty easy to get out from the Uh DIN rail mount. and uh, it's nice that they've got the Phoenix uh contact blocks on there. so I didn't have to unscrew anything and have you know, wires flapping around in the breeze. That's really nice and again, I'll just give you a bonus Marvel that uh, the wiring The Rat's Nest that is the back of this fuse box.
Yeah, it'd be a bit better. There's the neutral block down there and uh sorry, that's the Earth uh block and neutral lock as well. Yes, uh, you can upgrade these things and I do believe that if I add anything substantially more to the house. uh then it is a automatic uh like this would not meet current standard and you have to get it redone and I think they just read orders one big box here.

of course all the uh DIN rail stuff that they'd all go um in the one uh, you know, just the one huge box like that. So all the uh DIN rail there's my old uh kilowatt hour meter there like that would be, uh, that would be removed. This is the Ripple control line receiver for the uh off peak hot water system which we don't use anyway. I'm going to take my solo analytics back to the lab and Cracker open now.

Unfortunately, it looks like these things are not designed to come apart. Um, there's a split right down the middle so I don't know I don't have to take that off might it's probably like plastic Clips Well not having much luck so far. but listen to this. there's something loosey-goosey in there.

Um yeah, that's not good. trying to get some spudger tools in there and I I don't know it's oh, wait there we go. Oh look, look, oh my god. Well there's your problem.

There's what rattled that is a diode? Is it not a surface mount part? Just fell? Come on. Seriously. Okay, yeah, well, there's your problem. I don't think I've ever had that happen like a service Market component just falls out.

okay I got it. It's starting to crack in the plastic Clips but you have to know where they are to get it apart. Well, there it is. we're in and uh, there you go.

That's really interesting, isn't it? There's our oh, we've got some four big electrolytics here. They all look hunky-dory I'm gonna have to unscrew that. there's the SIM card because this is a uh three I think it's 3G Yay is that an Ernie Bernie Mark Yep, there we go. no workers and oh, there we go.

That's got a decent amount on it, doesn't it? Oh, there's a USB in there as well programming, doing whatever like a little um PCI kind of uh card Edge connector that's really quite nice I Was wondering how they were going to do this in here because you know it's quite a significant amount of stuff in here. This is, you know, got to do three phase measurement. What's a Centurion? This is all just interface over here. Where is our cap? vanish? ROM Yeah, there it is.

Ah G Ah yeah, Zappy Zappy. Um I Just got zapped I Just got zapped. That cap was charged. Oh oh yeah, that was A that was a good one.

That was the DC side of that that was charged up. Ouch. Oh my goodness. Anyway, I should have thought about that.

but what? There's no bleed resistor on there. Um for the Caps Of course these things aren't designed to be service. but jeez. okay.
still shaking my hand on that one. thumbs a bit tingly. Didn't give it a thought actually. But yeah, with hindsight, um yep.

I should have known that they were DC uh, input and caps charged to Mains potential. and yeah, Zappy! So I'm gonna I'm gonna get the meter and probe that. Oh geez, I'm still feeling that in the thumb. Unbelievable.

There you go Trap for young players, There's the cap. There you go. Yeah, 271 volts. So I can discharge that I'll have to get another meter because this one doesn't have the low Z.

Look what just happened to be lying around the ultra rare EV log Triple Five multimeter. No, you can't buy it. Um, well, actually, technically you can, um, go to Cane test and you can actually buy this. Not the EV blog Triple five Brandy But anyway, there we go.

We've discharged that sucker. And where's the other one that's discharged that? there will be some recovery on that. Yeah, you can see it, see the voltage recover. but uh, that is now safely discharged.

But yeah, wow, that held that for quite some time, didn't it? Let that be a lesson to you? obviously. I came a gutter there. They've got super caps on the output here. The 2.7 Volt five, Farad four, uh, with you know Brown out the mains fails.

Um, and that would keep it going I Don't know for how long you know you'd have to do your measurements or whatnot on here. Any other Magic Smoke escaped the other diodes. look okay. the Caps look all right.

Yeah, I can't read that on the camcorder screen. but that does look like an r in there. So I think a resistors kamagatsa where the diode is missing. From there it is.

and the this is the secondary side. This is secondary side. Okay, this is the primary Side 240 volts in. Okay, there's our switching Transformer and the secondary side.

here. The diode there has come completely off. The only reason it would do that is like if it's melted. If it's heated up so much.

that's where it's come from. That whole secondary site is Gonski and that looks like a probably a fusible input resistor layer. Let's let's check that, because obviously we've had a gross overload on the secondary. They are 10 ohms, so that's that's actually intact.

Now for probe the input. There you go. Yeah, there's definitely all three phases are. Well, that one's different.

But yeah, all three phases there are at least got some sort of connection. Yeah, it is definitely heated up. I Like do we have like a short in the diode or something because that discoloration in the PCB is all. It's where it's all burned.

Let's have a look at the main processor board first. Let's just have a squares. I See a solder bodge? Got a little bridge in there? Oh, granted, mine is like I Think mine is like one of the earlier units, so take that in mind. it's probably very refined now.
Lots of flux residue still on the header and stuff. What is? uh yeah, that? that's the oh no, that's pin header. Where does that go off? Uh, that's probably a production production test. headers I would say oh geez, look at that.

is that flux residue on the edge card Edge connector down there. Geez, that's not pretty Is it? Uh, that's like, has that happened after? Why would you have flux residue like that on the cart? Edge Connector: That's weird. I I'm not going to go into any reverse engineering that looks is that just an OP ampy. It's a microchip part down there.

The three pins tied together they the address lines. Some sort of addressable memory anyway that looks like the ADC down in there. 80 I Think if you look that up. Ade Seven, Double eight, zero.

so that's all the bottom of it. Don't all reverse engineer this thing. As I said, there is a USB interface that's the antenna connector there. if you flip it over, it's a Centurion ehs6.

So that's an all-in-one module. I Guess it does uh 3G as well because there's nothing else on here so that'll have like a little arm processory thing or something and it'll be one of those you know, all in one. Uh Wi-Fi uh no this is not. Wi-Fi Um so yeah.

like all in one modules. uh JK Consulting did this, Did they? September 2015. um I Reckon that resistor it is. It's completely cracked in half.

Look at that. Wow. it's completely cracked in half and moved and resolded itself in the like opposite direction because like they look, the numbers are on the front and the top here. so it's like it's it's split.

It's heated up so much that it's split. Why would it rotate like that? Has anyone ever seen a part rotate crack and rotate around like that? That seems incredible. My my thumb still hurts by the way. just saying.

I've felt that zap a couple of times before but wow like it was like I I put my thumb on it I think I have to re-watch the video and so it it. the path was just inside my thumb. There was no other. You know, it wasn't like going through my body to ground or anything.

but my, my thumb's still paying the price. Let me tell you. So, that resistor there one five something has come completely. Uh, it hasn't charred.

it's just heated up the resistor because it hasn't like there's just Gunk under it but that that's not the I. Don't think that's the PCB material that's actually charred. But what has actually charred is the PCB down in there. and this is where the diode came out there.

It is poor little on Sammy Jobby, it's complete D it was that De4 or something? was it. But yeah, it's it's just completely desoldered itself. What watches JK Consulting obviously uh designed this so JK done this design which actually looks, you know, quite decent. I Really like the design of it.
um and how they fitted it in a standard the standard DIN rail case in it's really good. So quite happy with the design. But yeah, why is it? Why is it coming outside like that? And for all you milf fan boys, oh I'm one of them. look at this.

Edge I Love a good MILF Look at this. Look at this beautiful that's obviously the input uh, divider because this is does a three-phase measurement so they're obviously we're got three pairs there. This this looks like a you know, a a good quality Bill What? What brand caps are these By the way Yep they're genuine matzo and contrary to their name, they're actually good capacitors. They're good Japanese capacitors.

so no, no worries there. this cap I Haven't heard of them, but they're the uh, they're the big, uh, ten farads total of uh, super caps on their 2.7 volts. So oh, they must, uh, they must be in series because nothing's going to be operating at less than 2.7 probably just a 3.3 volt. Rail And they've got or could even be five.

Yeah Now has been in service for six plus years. I Have to get the exact date of the video. So I just paid for a new Five-Year Plan on this thing. You know you pay for the data plan because it it has to talk.

You know, um, to the thing, it isn't much, doesn't actually cost a huge amount. Have you ever seen one like that? Because that's a that's a Bobby dazzler. Can we have a minute silence for that poor resistor? Um, that that is not sold a day? It was not. This would have been nicely re flowed.

Um, sold it at the time. And yeah, and uh, it's just it's melted. And when you heat up components enough, yeah, they melt shoulder joints and components like this diode literally fall off. It's not uncommon, especially if it's in the right orientation for it to fall off and gravity does its thing.

Now, my first thought about the failure mode of this thing was that the diode went short because that is a failure mode. Uh, for diode. Well, it went low resistance and then it had heated up internally and then that caused because there's no fusing on the output. It doesn't seem to be any fusing on the output there.

They've got a series resistor here, but I think that's for is that for charging this and that's for charging the Super caps is it? But anyway. um yeah. so it was drawing all the power that the primary could give it via this. Uh, very nice looking worth.

Uh Transformer here and uh yeah. it was given it. It was given it all it could and this poor resistor which is on the primary side. um it was.

It was pulling all the power from the primary side and it just couldn't handle it. Um, so this poor resistors come with gutsa uh it's not like the resistor. uh, failed. It failed because it was drawing too much.

Uh, the secondary was causing too much power. But what caused the diode uh to fail. If you look and you've got to remember we've got all this Gunk down here. Okay, where did this come from? It's accumulated in the connector.
Uh-huh Have a look down in there. that's Super Cap. looks like it's Kamagatsa. Check it out.

It spewed its guts I Think that spewed its guts everywhere. and yet hence why the PCB looks like filthy. And why look I mean why do we have this Gunk under the resistor here? What is this? Gunk Okay, that is probably dried electrolyte from the super cap. but I Still, it's not like the electrol I got under there and it became conductive and that's no I think there's a serious excess overpower event there because that that PCB is it is it actually burnt? I mean there is some electrolyte residue under there.

but yeah, it's just the dirty nature of the PCB it seems to have like Gunk like everywhere on it. it's like yeah, I don't think it was that. feel like you know it's all around here as well. and if you look at the physical location okay and uh, where gravity is taking this thing.

but interestingly if you see how it's mounted like this then it makes sense if like it was physically mounted like this, the leads were over this side so if this cap super cap leaks then it's all going to fall down like that in that direction. and yeah, it will accumulate, emulate in the connector and I can't see how it can actually get up into like you know, like climb up into here and because that's against it's it's physically this board's physically vertical like that. um it looks like that's leaked I'm going to desolder that and we'll have a look at the bottom of it. but I did test these caps before and they did actually seem to charge up with my um ohmmeter so you know, like, very incredibly slowly.

They both said to charge up though. All right. Oh yeah, look at that. Yeah.

I reckon she's she's spewed her guts. That's uh, the only reason that would happen to the bottom of that. and that yellow ring all around it. Yeah, yeah.

I think this is the uh, this is, of course. Super Cap failed, spewed its guts, and then it did whatever. and then the failure mode. after that, it doesn't it? It almost doesn't matter, does it? And you can see on the PCB down here that's electrolyte yet wet gotcha.

That's wet electrolyte. Look at that. Yeah, it's gone down okay. Wicked into the connector like that.

and yeah, yeah, it's all still wet. So there you go. Super Cap fire. Oh that that track there? Is that starting to? oh, that's starting to go black I don't I don't like it I don't like it.

Like you could fix this. You could repair it. Um, and if that has actually gone conductive under there, you'd have to like, probably drill it out so it's not, uh, conductive and uh, everything's starting to corrode and it's It's not pretty. If you're desperate, you could actually repair this.

but uh, yeah, no. Anyway, I'll send this video to Uh. Solar Analytics and see if they've had any other failures of, uh, these Super caps. uh Nest Cap I Don't know I haven't used them before anyone? No if they're any good, but uh yeah.
like all the other components in this same top quality. So yeah, I don't doubt that there, um, top quality caps? they've just failed. Did it get too hot in the Aussie Sun Uh, my fuse box happens to be on the uh, afternoon sun side so it would actually get hot. And anyway, there you go.

Super Cap Fire. Wow. Wow. It spewed its guts and then that caused a poor diode to completely desolder itself.

and then this, that magnificent resistor that's just snapped ceramic base is just snapped in half and then resolded in the other direction. That's terrific. That is a great folio mode. I Love it anyway.

I hope you found that interesting. If you did, please give it a big thumbs up. especially for me zapping myself. Um, yeah, that was dumb.

Dave Trademark Uh yeah, don't make that same mistake. Anyway, give it a big thumbs up. comments down below: Um I'll let you know what. um, Solar Analytics? uh say and I guess I'm without a monitoring system although I've got like three other monitoring systems so you know, but this one is like the combined one.

But anyway, see what they have to say and I'll get back to you. Maybe if the second Channel videos for something like that for the follow-up Catch you next time foreign.

Avatar photo

By YTB

24 thoughts on “Eevblog 1511 – solar analytics system fail! dave gets zapped!”
  1. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Valenorious says:

    ElectroBoom approves of the pain inflicted in this video.

  2. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Rorschach1024 says:

    If yall used a reasonable line voltage like civilized countries do, it wouldn't have hurt so damned much! =b

  3. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Rob65 says:

    When detecting the 2 supercaps in series I immediately got concerned about them being balanced.
    @gorak9000 mentioned this too: supercaps don't like to be overcharged to a higher voltage and when placing supercaps in series there should always be some protection to prevent that from happening.
    Balance resistors are great for small caps (we used to design high voltage capacitor banks that way) but for those large supercaps balancing resistors are not enough. At least some zener diodes or even better one of those active balancing chips especially designed for supercaps should have been used. But writing this I do remember that, back then, I was advices to just place balancing resistors over my supercaps by a component supplier.

  4. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Erik Andersson says:

    Constant vigilance is needed so that captain zap brannigan don’t make love to you, just one moment is all it takes, apparently. 🙂

  5. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Tim Savage says:

    Are there any models of energy monitoring tied to a stupid cloud service?

    I currently have two systems in my house one from the solar installation that uses 3G and the other from the hot water system that connects to a gateway over powerline and then to Ethernet. Neither of them can be queried directly for information, have to use an app with an undocumented API. I have already reverse-engineered one to integrate the data into Home Assistant, but it's a bit silly sending the data to a cloud service to just bring it back again, and assuming the company doesn't go belly up or abandon the service.

  6. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Gabriel Ionescu says:

    It would be nice a repair video of that device…

  7. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars GRC says:

    Had Issues with nesscap supercaps in the previous company, back in 2015 so it's similar date with your product. They often leaked and coroded the PCB, althoug we were using much bigger size 55F-60F I recall.

  8. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Gordon Welcher says:

    Is that the way fuse boxes are made down there?
    Just bolt the breakers on and wire them in the back?
    Yank breakers are much neater.

  9. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars RobR386 says:

    I zapped myself on an amplifier board when I was fixing my minidisc mini system, same way by putting my finger across a charged cap 🤣

  10. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars tweed532 says:

    Must have been a 'zap Dave day', as I got a 'tingle' changing the back light led strips in my LG TV, even though it had been powered down for over 8 hrs!.. Darned led driver psu caps… Cheers from a miffed Dave in the UK..😟

  11. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Ein Felder says:

    Speaking of electrical zaps – years ago I was mowing the paddock with an old Victa which had the fuel tap just above the spark plug, and the only way to turn the thing off was to close the fuel and let it run out. I woke up about 10 feet behind the mower on my ass – the mower was stopped so it either ran out while I was out, or I stole all the spark……. probably 10 years old at the time.

  12. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars hallcrash says:

    Dave almost died in this video.

  13. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Drew says:

    You almost let the "magic smoke" out of yourself with that CapZap mate. Glad you had enough charge left in you to finish the video.

  14. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Wintersky136 says:

    Why don’t you replace your board with a modern schneider or hager?

  15. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars SeanBZA says:

    New one will fit in the same box, just will have a nice big DIN rail box to hold all the breakers and other DIN rail mounted units, with the meters now all being on the top row in a line. Plenty of space then for extension.

    When you replace the heater, insulate all the hot water pipes both outside and inside the roof, so as to minimise the heat loss from the long runs.

  16. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars donepearce says:

    The gunk under the resistor. Is it the remains of the glue dot?

  17. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Andrew Dollins says:

    That is one rats nest Dave, Dave why are you taking my circuits apart you are shocked for it the thumb Dave, yep I think this is an overload Dave. That is a overload Dave…..

  18. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars jugularSignal says:

    I haven't seen every video, but I've been watching for years and this is the first time I've seen Dave get zapped.

  19. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars E Hiebert says:

    Thanks for the video.
    The resister needs to go straight to the pool room.

  20. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars DGO says:

    Capillary action in action.

  21. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Meta Observer says:

    shifty eyes appears to notice a lack of RCD (after noticing the same during a power company directed fault test at my place)

  22. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars valimakm says:

    The isolation between AC mains and secondary circuit does not look safe on the power supply board. The 3G antenna is accessible so there should be double/reinforced insulation on that power supply. This kind of equipment should be designed taking over voltage category III requirements into consideration.

  23. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars CampKohler says:

    You are now an official member of the ElectroBOOM club!

  24. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Solar Analytics says:

    Oh no! Sorry to hear the device is dead. We'd love to help you out and will be in touch!🌞

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